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Talk:Umzamo Styles
Fayd: Just something I noticed: Ant specialization 1 grants bonuses from Ant, while 2 and 3 grant bonuses from a different style. Intended or a mistake? Also, I was thinking about how to grant bonus Umzamo die... if we want to do this (and I think we should), what do you think it should be? A mental stat or a physical one? Perhaps one or the other (Wis or Con, for example)? Does specialization work the same way as for magic (spend an additional style, gain 1 level of specialization? And by that token, is magic specialization changing to meet the style specializations?) If so, a feat similar to Broad Repetoire may be in order. Also: Are all supposed to have 3 levels of specialization? If you'd like, we can brainstorm up some more levels. Tam: No, the Ant style was a typo. Fixed now. I'm not sure what you mean about mental or physical stats with regard to Umzamo dice. Let me clarify what I mean: If you have Tiger Style (no specialization) active and charge, you get a free Umzamo die that can only be used to increase number of attacks, just as if you had spent an Umzamo die yourself. However, this free die is just that, free. You don't have to spend Umzamo dice yourself, though you certainly can. Additionally, free Umzamo dice don't count towards your max Umzamo dice spent per turn. Yes, spend an additional style, gain one level of specialization. Magical specialization will also be changed, but it won't start granting bonuses until specialization 1. And yes, there will be a Umzamo equivilant to Broad Repetoire. No, not all of them are supposed to be four tiers; about a quarter of them are intended to be easier to master. Fayd: With regard to the stats thing: Magic users get more mana from having a high ability score. I could see some parallel with martial arts users and total umzamo die. The problem being I can't really figure out if I would want to grant the bonus max die to be based upon a physical stat or a mental one. It comes down to a difference in style and causing the classes to be dependant upon more stats again. Tam: But Umzamo isn't dependent on ability scores like magic is. Max Dice is determined solely by your UL. The circumstances in which you gain bonus dice is solely dependent on your styles. Heck, the only time I mention ability scores on this page is for save DCs. Where did you get this idea? Fayd: Your endurance in your fighting style isn't dependant upon your innate strength/endurance of body or spirit? It just seems to me that in some cases, some fighters, though of equal level and class, might be able to pull off their tricks for different amounts of time. I thought of it because of the initial transparency of UL to CL that sparked this system. I don't know where I got the idea. Why isn't it something that is dependant upon ability scores? It seems to me that it is something that would be. Tam: Because how long you can fight, for everyone, is dependent on Endurance. Magic is taking something from outside yourself, and channeling it through yourself. There's a hard limit on how much you can manage. Umzamo is just training (or at most, internal and physical magic). As long as you can lift a weapon, you can fight. Fayd: Internal spiritual/physical strength, innate or through training... isn't that exactly what Wis/Con represent? And isn't there a hard limit on how much one cam manage through Umzamo as well? I'm really just having trouble seeing why the max Umzamo die that a person has available isn't at least somewhat dependant upon their physical (or possibly mental) attributes. (Also: Part of the reason I'm discussing it here is so Paul can comment as well, without me having to act as an intermediary.) Paul: Well, At present, I actually don't feel that I have enough information. How do Umzamo die work? How are the die refreshed? When one charges with tiger-style, for example, is that every time you charge, or just the first time in a set period? I can understand Fayd's points, but, until I have a better understanding on how some of the inner-workings of the Umzamo Dice, I can't really give much feedback of my own. I like the idea of perhaps the dice being influenced by stats to a minor degree, because, if we were to look at it like chi, a nonfrail, wise person would be better able to harness it, BUT... The idea of chi coming through training only also is a valid interpretation. So, yeah. I have no relevant feedback at this time. The questions I asked above, however, might help me give better feedback. Paul(further thoughts): On the other hand, if we want to just view the UL as being an enabler(w/limits) for a playet do to fancy fighting, flavored in whatever way they like, I'd side with the flat per-level side of the argument. If it's on the chi side of things, I'd more be inclined to side with Fayd's point, however. Tam: For the most part, Umzamo is not chi. It's wrestling, muay thai or kung-fu. Only the mystical styles (basilisk, turtle, etc) are chi-based. As long as you have the relevant style up, and the proper circumstances trigger, you get the bonus dice. To use a real-world example: If you lock up with your opponent in Muay Thai, you're supposed to start dropping elbows on their neck and throw knees into their short ribs (when grappling, bonus Umzamo die for number of attacks). If you take down an opponent in wrestling, you're supposed to pin them (when grappling, bonus Umzamo die for grappling). Even if you're exhausted, you still have that training, and you can still try it, but it may not work. Paul: My other question still stands, however... I am still wondering about how the styles work. For tiger style, does one get the bonus die -every- time one charges, or only the -first- time? Tam: Every time. Paul: Yeah. Regardless of what the Umzamo dice -are- and where they come from, etc... As a balance issue, if the bonus die come every time a style procs, stats should not increase the die totals. It would be too unfair. I now stand against stats improving die numbers.